Talk:Rules/Skills

Only prob i see is the cha skills. Try this instead:

Diplomacy [Diplomacy, Intimidate]

Perform [Perform, Gather Information] AKA Work the crowd

Ledgermain [Sleight of Hand, Escape Artist]

Go out of town for a few days and all goes amok. --Arz 16:05, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

I still say an empathy [heal, sense motive] skill set is a good combination since both skills don't come up often enough to be singled out. That, and the nameset also fits well. --Askewnotion 16:19, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Me too ;) --Mqs 17:44, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

I agree with Ledgermain above. --Randy (Talk) 16:52, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

I also. Shall we? --Mqs 17:44, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

The problem with merging Dipl. and Intim. is that they truly are very different. Both are cha-based social skills, but being good at one and the other are pretty much mutually exclusive. I understand, also, your desire for Perform + Gather Information. Randy, how do you feel about that one? Gather Information fits soundly with both. --Mqs 17:44, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Performing is to talking to a crowd, while gathering information is talking with people. I think that it's a better fit with Diplomacy. --Randy (Talk) 17:49, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

A series of people, however, as Mike puts it. I do prefer it with Dipl. --Mqs 17:51, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Diplo-timidate is mostly interpersonal v. group exhortation ala perform-ation. Gather info is not dealing with strictly one person, but more often a series and some small groups. I can safely say I will not be 100% satisfied with all the combos. Heck perform/gather isn't perfect, just closer. --Arz 15:48, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

Based on this conversation, might I suggest making a Streetwise skill? Combine Sense Motive and Gather Information?

WIS vs CHA. --Mqs 16:11, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

Bah. All social skills should be CHA. It would simplify things at least. In any case, with that in mind, I think putting Diplomacy and Gather Information makes more sense than Perform and Gather Information. I still think all social skills should be CHA. --T3knomanser 16:54, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

Sense Motive is the perfect Wisdom (intuition) skill. --Mqs 16:43, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

Depends on your perspective. One could argue that it's less about intuition and more about detecting subtle social cues. To me, that makes more sense. I've always seen WIS more as practical application of knowledge and INT as book learnin'. Also, looking at your combinations, I just noticed that you've combined a few other skills regardless of their attribute linkage. Ride(DEX)/Handle Animal(CHA); Survival(WIS)/Use Rope(DEX). So one could make the argument that Sense Motive/Gather Information could be combined into Streetwise. And then one could have a separate argument about whether they should be CHA or WIS skills, since gathering information could be seen as WIS related as well as CHA related, if you take the stance that it's about intuitive synthesis of information. --T3knomanser 16:54, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

You make many valid points, and have convinced me. Randy? Others? --Mqs 17:09, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

I am convinced. Make Streetwise happen. Since Diplomacy is losing Gather Info, should Diplomacy and Intimidate be merged? I'm on the fence about that, but I wanted the opinion of others. --Randy (Talk) 17:30, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

Depends. Do you think Diplomacy needs to cover more terrain to remain useful? Diplomacy is about getting people to do what you want by offering them a carrot; intimidate is about offering them the stick. A successful diplomat needs to be able to do both, but in game terms, intimidate is more about looking scary. --T3knomanser 17:34, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

In game terms, both use force of personality (CHA) to effect behavior changes on people so I think that merging makes sense. --Randy (Talk) 18:13, 9 January 2009 (UTC)