Wild talk:Alterations

I'd like to propose an alternative to Exped. Retreat, because I think the spell is kinda stupid in one specific way: it only effects Land Speed. All of the other spells that affect other movement types give you that movement type as part of their effect. I'd like to propose this modification: when casting Exped. Retreat, you can declare what movement type it's operating on, and it adds +30 to that movement type, if you have that movement type. Basically, the +movement spells are all biased towards people who have only one movement type. --t3knomanser 15:52, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

I would propose a spell named Expeditious Swim that would be identical to Expeditious Retreat except that it would apply only to swim speeds. Usually movement spells are all separate spells.

• Branch to Branch, Druid/Ranger 1, grants brachiation and +10 movement
• Rapid Burrowing, Druid/Ranger 1, +20 burrow speed
• Burrow, Druid/Ranger 2, grants burrow speed of 30 (20 in light armor)
• Cloud Wings, Druid 2, +30 fly speed for 1 hour@CL
• Master Air, Druid 2, grant 90 fly for 1 rnd@CL
• Swim, Druid/Sorc-Wiz 2, grant swim 30

--Randy (Talk) 16:44, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

Randy is correct. This effect is typically a separate spell for each. Browse the Spell Compendium, mostly the druid list. It won't be hard to talk me into letting one be added to the duskblade list for you. --Mqs 17:06, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

There's Wings of Water or somesuch. My main issue is that most of the additional ones grant the movement type and then add movement- I could have sworn it was less than Exped. Retreat. I think Water Wings was +20. It just seems silly to have spells granting movement types mixed in with spells that just make you faster, and I figured it didn't hurt to ask. That, and since I only get one lvl. 1 per level, it's a little expensive to get Swimmy Wings and Exped. Retreat. --t3knomanser 18:16, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

I agree that having different spells to boost different movement types is ridiculous. Unfortunately having multiple spells that are nearly identical (e.g. Orb spells from SpC) is something that is well established in the gaming system. Except for psionics—they tend to have one spell with multiple effects (e.g. Energy Ray). :-) --Randy (Talk) 18:26, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

Doh! *facepalm* When you put it that way, what was I thinking? x is ridiculous in D&D? That's how it was designed to work! --t3knomanser 20:26, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

How about a spell that effects all movement speeds with a lower benefit. Perhaps +15 or +20 to all base speeds? --Askewnotion 20:56, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

Different movement types are of different values. But, those that grant flying (high value...) tend to grant vastly more speed than those that grant climb or swim (lesser values). Remy, let there be some percolation in the brain. --Mqs 20:22, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

What I'm looking for is a spell that doesn't grant anything, but adds +30 to any one movement speed you have. Percolate. I'm not attached to anything, but it just makes sense to me that way. --t3knomanser 21:55, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

As we discussed today, +30' burrow's more valuable than +30' climb's more valuable than +30' swim's... yadda. Anyway, I think that, due to the nature of this particular setting, it's quite feasible that casters have worked this problem out. I will do it -- I just need to figure out how. --Mqs 20:29, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

I will suggest again, +20' to all forms of movement currently possessed by a creature seems reasonable. That way it is one spell that would be good on land or water, but not as good as one specialized for either condition. --Askewnotion 20:54, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

A spell that would grant +20' to all forms of movement wouldn't be a first level spell and wouldn't serve Remy's purpose. I do wish that the d20 gaming system had a consistent methodology for handling granting movement bonuses and types. --Randy (Talk) 00:40, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

Even if it only granted it to the movement naturally possessed by the creature? I meen, obviously it wouldn't give you fly, burrow, swim, climb, and land just by virtue of the spell. For Remy it would only give him +20' to swim and land. Personally, it sounds fair to me. 15' wouldn't be bad either. Note, it would only last for one round, so any less than this doesn't seem worthwhile. --Askewnotion 02:49, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

That makes sense. Since Duskblades get Swift Exped, I'd argue that, at least for a Duskblade, it should be a swift spell. But, if it only lasts one round, it sounds sort of like it should be a swift spell for everyone. --t3knomanser 17:27, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

My assumption that we were talking about the swift one to begin with. --Askewnotion 22:15, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

Why solve only one specific problem, when a well thought out change could solve a whole class of clumsy problems. Think like a programmer! --t3knomanser 02:37, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Or like an interaction designer! I was thinking that all these movement spells need some consistency. My D&D time is spent elsewhere currently, working on a better framework for the d20 site so that stuff can get added to it easier and quicker, and by more people than just me! --Randy (Talk) 03:26, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Breaking down the problem(s)

Granting access to movement types and determining importance of each (burrow, fly, swim, etc.)

Granting bonus to a movement type and how it intersects with different spell lists and spellcasters native movement types

Fine tuning particulars, such as:

Duration

Casting time (including swift versions)